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I guess my take on the issue centers around "not tonight" and "not now" and "later" and....you get the idea. How many times does a guy need to here that before he just quits asking all together? It's a slippery slope!
One of the hardest things to keep active in any relationship is the physical aspect that in 9 out of 10 relationships brought you together in the first place.
Does everyone realize that I am the only single one in this mix? Things are different for me, and my perspective obviously isn't going to be relatable to everyone else. I have no experience with being in a healthy, or loving marriage. So, I suppose I stand to learn somethings from this as well. Which is good.
I don't have ALL the answers, lol.
Looking forward to all the feedback.
For us, I think it works well for me to be the initiator, Mr.T works all day, managing people, telling them what to do and I think a little provocation from his spouse helps him at the end of the day. But that is said lightly, because you don't always want the weight of sex initiation to be on one of your shoulders solely.
We have found a way to keep it fun, spontaneous and sometimes even *gasp* planned. We haven't lost the spark to keep the creative juices flowing and even after 2 kids, 7 years of marriage, gaining incredible amounts of weight to support the growth of humans and body parts settling a few inches south of where I would prefer-I think we both feel completely comfortable where we are. And can still have fun and appreciate that we have gone these distances arm in arm.
or
like: 'ewww...please leave me be....'
or
like: 'hmm....maybe after you figure out where to stick that thing'
or
like: 'MUST I EXPLAIN EVERYTHING?!'
But not ME. That would NEVER happen to me. ;)
One thing that I don't understand is why we have to do all the work? I'm not trying to start a fight, but if women say they like sex then why is it all on our shoulders to be romantic and make you feel relaxed? I'm just as involved in my daughters life as my wife...I work just as long as she does...and to be honest - I probably clean more than she does.
I have a ? for the guys...My husband never once touched me, AT ALL, through all 3 pregnancies. Do you guys really not mind prego sex?
Trust me - I've tried to have prego sex with the wife but she made it VERY clear that we would not be having sex. It really is an ego killer to a man. I really think my wife is ultra paranoid about having sex during pregnancy...is it normal for women to NOT want to have sex AT ALL during pregnancy? I miss my wife...[pity music playing in the background] It's very difficult for us guys to go that long without a physical connection...weird things start going through our brains.
Normally, I'd say you need to tell her that, what you just said up there, but pregnancy is the hall pass of booty. She's got a hall pass, and I hope for your sake you've got a lot of Vasoline. :)
1. Guys, don't be asses where sex is involved. It really gets you no place
2. Ladies, please don't use sex as a weapon. Unless it's really deserved (see point one) which should be almost never.
3. Find time to make it happen, but remember sometimes one of you may really have a headache or may really be tired.
4. Don't be afraid to seek counseling. This physical part is a big part of the success of a healthy marriage.
The main thing is physical. After the baby, laying around kissing and cuddling becomes the baby's territory. I go to make-out with my hubby and feel like I don't remember how to kiss anymore or that my teeth are too big I feel like I'll bite him! LOL! I just sometimes feel like I don't know how to do it like before. But we get into it and it's HOT but then the baby starts crying. I'm breastfeeding so my doctor tells me that my "fluids" for "smoother transition" are dried up making it hard for me to even get started. Then it takes me super-long to finish and by that time, the chemistry is gone and it becomes a job. The key is not to take yourselves too seriously and know that this is not the rest of your life. Plus going long without it, but once a month you have that super-psychedelic orgasm is better than bickering over it every day and then only one finishing while the other feels like being taken advantage of. Joke: When my husband approaches me after the encounter described above, I tell him, Honey, we already met our quota for this month, see you in May! That gets him to laugh every single time.
Your sex life will not suffer forever. I want to add one more thing...with the previous discussion on appearance. Guys, work on that BELLY! I'm one of those women that LOVE to be on top, but it pisses me off if the MOTION is interrupted by the gut there if you know what i'm saying. Ok, I'll just blush now and go away.
About the co-sleeping...funny story. When my 2nd son was about 4 months old, I got a call from my midwife. She said she was calling on behalf of my husband, who didn't know how to tell me himself, but if I didn't get that kid out of his bed soon he was going to go insane. I got the kid out of the bed.
I think in my situation I can understand how guys must feel being turned down for no apparent reason. Obv, something is going on that the spouse wont fess up to. And I don't mean they are having an affair or something like that. But SOMETHING is going on with them that they don't want you physically anymore. The amount of damage that can be done while they refuse to talk to you about the real issue is staggering. It is something that our marriage still hasn't rebounded from, years later.
All that said, I'm still hopeful that we can get back to where we once were. It is just a lot harder than I ever imagined.
After a baby comes out of your nether regions in a rather traumatic, violent (oh, wait, I mean beautiful) way, we might be a little hesitant to allow anything other than witch hazel near the exit point. And even when given the go ahead by doctor to get busy, we might be a tad bit nervous - I mean, the pain of healing is still pretty fresh. So, even if conditions are perfect and you've massaged our feet and bought us flowers and put the baby to bed - even if Barry White's playing on the stereo, we still might be scared.
And that nervousness, it leads to um...tension. Muscular tension. Which can make the whole need for gentility ever more important.
Mark my words, if you go blazing in there, as if you've got six minutes and you need to make them the hottest (read acrobatic) possible, your lady might be a little fearful. She might be doubled over in pain afterwards. She might look at you for the next couple months as that guy who just wants to hurt her in that special place all over again.
Point. Before you consider all the future sex and how you're going to regularly tap that, make that first time after birth one that she'll maybe wanna revisit or improve upon. Cuz if she's shrinking away in fear, you might be hearing "I'm so tired" a lot more than you would otherwise.
All of the ladies' insights were very good. I think our situation mirrors Kim's the most. We still have that spark and when we do have opportunities to get down and dirty, it's all very good and satisfying. Our challenge, mostly during the week, is fatigue. And it affects both of us. Although it may not be very romantical, we've become planners. We wake up in the morning and are feeling the love, so we make it a date and do everything we can throughout the day to make sure we're prepared (and not too tired) for our frisky, late evening rendevous. Anticipation is the driver. Sure, it lacks spontaneity, but we forget about that when the moment arrives. And, on occasion it doesn't work out, but 90 percent of the time it does. That's a pretty good success rate if you ask me.
The only difficulty we have is that my wife has a chronic heart condition. Sometimes she just doesn't have strength. It took me a while, but I now understand how to help her be okay with that. It used to frustrate both of us, but it's amazing how being kind and caring in those moments leads to better sex later.
I understand that women are different than men in that they have different hormones, and after having children there are certain things that happen to the chemical and physical makeup of a woman's body that don't happen to men. I understand how those differences have to be acknowledged.
But as for the rest - work stress, home stress, taking care of kids stress, etc etc etc. I don't see that as an adequate excuse, unless the husband is doing none of the work. I for one, since our kids were born (and they're 12 and 8 now) have almost equally split the daily chores and kid care between us. We both work full time, come home, spend time with the kids, do housework when necessary like laundry and cleaning, make dinner, help with homework, pack for school the next day, get them in bed and settled. All the things the moms above mentioned above, I do most every day. And I don't think I've once been just too mentally or physically exhausted to want to get close to my wife at day's end. Certainly not enough to where a pattern could be seen....
There's always enough energy left over, and we each expend about the same energy during the day - what it takes is, a) enjoying it, b) getting something personal and fulfilling out of it with the one you love, c) understanding it's important to a healthy relationship.
If there's enough excuses of "not tonight, I'm tired", "the kids are pooping/peeing/stressing me out too much", or "I don't have time..." to not be isolated incidents, then there's something else at work.
I'm just saying if it's important to you, you'll make time for it. You won't make excuses. As some said, it can be used as a manipulation and control tool and even subconsciously it's damaging to a relationship
I agree with Barry about having no excuses. Sex should be not forced upon. It is natural and essential in a marriage and both should not forget that. If it's difficult, then something else is wrong in the marriage that needs fixing.
start working (even mildly) opposite shifts.
I am at home with the kids during the days, a gig I LOVE. It's backbreaking work, harder than any other 9-5 I've had, but I wouldn't trade it for anything. So anyway, I am home days but work part time nights, 6-11pm. My wife works 40+ hours during 'normal' working hours. this being the case she and I see each other enough to exchange pleasantries and trade pecks on the cheek when she gets home from work.
Then, when I get home from work she is usually out cold. Putting 4 kids through dinner/homework/bathes/bedtime routine has her beat.
I would love to open the office for "Business Time".... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGOohBytKTU
she would love nothing more too. But when all you want to do is sleep than it's usually not much more than a nice idea.
So, yeah, would I like more.. DUH! Would she like more, YUP. In fact most days I think she's Jonesin' more than I am.
Sigh, every thing's a trade off in life.
That's such a hard one. After three years, well, it's not the kid, man. It's her, and I hate to say that. Before I say what I'm going to say, I am going to ask this JUST AS A PREFACE (because I don't actually think this is your fault). Is there ANY reason she'd be relucant? Has there been any history of infidelity? Is there any substance abuse in the home? Are you sure sex is satisfying for her? (Example, when my husband finishes WAY after or WAY before me, well, I get annoyed. Like, pissy annoyed. Like, don't ever touch me again annoyed. No one likes to feel like a tube sock.) Is there any history of sexual abuse in her past? My personal issues with that really didn't surface until after my kids were born.
If none of those are factors, I think you need to ask her to seek help. I had to sit my husband down and I basically said, "You are being cruel, here. I love you and I don't want to leave you but you cannot do this to me. Either go to a doctor and fix this or we cannot stay married."
We couldn't have stayed married because people need to have sex. Married people NEED that intimacy. If you go much longer without, you will stray. You won't be able to help it. Or, at least, you will WANT to stray, and at that point, the marriage is doomed.
A lot of women suffer lack of libido from either A) being on mood-stabilizing meds or B) NOT being on meds that they need to be. My husband's doctor got to the root of his main issue (Depression, that's what I'm guessing is going on with your wife) and once he was treating that, his libido returned. I also started a course of meds to treat my depression that stemmed from being in a shitty marriage. (It's not shitty anymore, just sayin.)
I am sorry to write such a glum response, but I have been there, and it almost destroyed my life until I took MAJOR steps to fix it. There is only so much we can do, and at some point the other person has to take their share of the responsibility. She's not just ending her own sex life, she's dictating yours.
Incidentally, (so as to not get beat up in an alley) I would give this same advice to a women. Sex is universal.
Now... I have to disagree with your comment...
"We couldn't have stayed married because people need to have sex. Married people NEED that intimacy."
People do not need to have sex. It was not created as a way of recreation, rather pro-creation. If you need to have sex to feel intimate, It seems like you have another issue. Many you need to seek the help.
To tell your husband he needed to get help or you would leave is crazy. So now, he has forced sex with you to keep his marriage. That is just wrong in my opinion. How could you even want to have sex with someone who only is doing it to keep your mouth shut?
You can be intimate with a loved one without sex.
Someone does not need help becuase they do not want to have sex. Point blank everyone does not want to get it on every day.
Oh yeh, and an extra quick tip. If you want your sex to be as exciting as it used to be, don't make it more work for your wife (I.e. meaning she has to do more laundry <sheets/towels/whatever>, cleaning, picking up, etc.).
And, for me...I go by lists...I have certain things I aim to accomplish in a day...and by gosh, I will. So, if husband came home and generously offered to do the dishes and clean for 10 minutes FIRST and THEN put the moves on me...I'd be more likely to oblige then if I'm looking at a whole bunch of mess and my to-do list is running through my head. So, if your wife does lists in her head...you could always help with those so she CAN relax and enjoy sex...
I completely agree that if it's important you'll make time for it. But sometimes the importance of sex gets lost in midst of everything else. That's not to say that it shouldn't be important. It should be. And I can't remember the last time either one of us told the other one no -- we work hard to not. But it needs to be pointed out that it's not always the case that the work is split half and half.
I'm impressed that you guys have found a way to keep a healthy sex life, if dad isn't really pulling his weight at home. It's good that you are, as it will just be one less problem to deal with otherwise (and, it's kinda fun, right?). I'm sure the ladies would have more to say, especially my wife - she wouldn't put up with that shit at all from me, but it's hard to change a person without them want to do so. I want to be a good man because it makes me feel better about myself. I don't want to sit around on my ass when I'm home, doing nothing - it doesn't feel good, and it's selfish, but...that's just me.
Thanks for the comment!
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Lenjerie Pat